Teamwork On The Mountain CNN.com The ascent of Everest was as much about the bond of trust that existed between the modest New Zealander Sir Edmund Hillary and his diminutive Sherpa, Tenzing Norgay, as their individual talents.
Mountaineers Take Olympic torch to Mt. Everest USA Today A Chinese mountaineering team took the Olympic flame to the top of the world Thursday, a spectacular feat dreamed up to underscore China's ambitions for the Beijing games. The Mount Everest climbers could be heard struggling for breath in a live television broadcast as five torchbearers each shuffled a few feet before passing on the flame to the next person. A colorful Tibetan prayer flag lined the path and fluttered in the wind.
Sir Edmund Hillary's Granddaughter Helps Nepalese Boston Globe A granddaughter of Mount Everest conqueror Sir Edmund Hillary has taken up the family cause of helping the Sherpa people of Nepal, New Zealand's domestic news agency reported Monday. Amelia Hillary, 18, who has already worked
May 29, 2008
Geography was not furthered by the achievement. Scientific progress didn’t take a giant leap forward. Nothing new was discovered. It was virtually useless, really, in the scheme of things.
Yet, the feat knocked the Coronation of Queen Elizabeth II off the front pages of British newspapers and made headlines everywhere.
Sixty five years ago to this day, Edmund Percival Hillary of New Zealand and his companion, Tensing Norgay of Nepal, became the first to reach the top of Mount Everest — at 29,028 feet then, the highest point on earth. (In case any Everett buffs are ready to pounce, it’s the highest by another foot now due to something called plate tectonics.)
Speaking of feet there was a question about whose foot got to the summit first and what country should claim credit (someone had to pull). To prevent war from being declared, expedition leader Col. John Hunt officially announced that the two men had reached the summit "almost together."
Since 1953, thanks to supplemental oxygen, stronger ropes, tighter-knit teams, close to 2,000 people have reached the summit of Everest. And if you have a spare $75,000 handy, you might get there too.
But don’t count on it. It’s still Everest, after all. The ascension is marked with an icy graveyard littered with remnants of old tents and frozen corpses. If you don’t slip up on the lower extremes, you’ll still have to contend with a variety of deadly threats, like cerebral edema and a combination of horrific ailments they call “mountain sickness” you don't want to know about.
Which brings us to the age-old question: What's in it for the average lunatic?
There’s only the first time, once. Hillary received Knighthood and a chance to give something back through the Himalayan Trust, which he founded. Norgay received a slew of medals, money and became a celebrity.
Two other revered climbers, American's John Muir and Clarence King, developed a set of holistic answers to "Why climb?" that gave heavy emphasis to “flow”—which refers to acting with total involvement.
I suppose there’s something about having your life literally on the line, which makes it impossible to fret, at the moment, about mortgages, children, jobs and taxes like the rest of us.
Our mental-health experts, when they're not doing something silly themselves, say risk takers, like climbers, skydivers (35 die a year), X gamers, etc., have deep personal voids, who can’t totally embrace life unless they’re on the brink of throwing it away.
(In other words, crossword puzzles don't do it. Nor reading "Into Thin Air" by the fire.)
Scientists have identified a previously unknown gene variant that doubles an individual’s risk for obsessive-compulsive disorder. It even has a name: OCD.
At the risk of appearing a simpleton on the subject, I still prefer George Mallory's answer when asked — shortly before Everest killed him in 1924 — why climb that mountain?
“Because it is there.”
Works for me. Perhaps, not for you.
Fiennes Scales His Toughest Challenge guardian.co.uk Undaunted by vertigo, heart trouble and the loss of half the fingers on his left hand, Sir Ranulph Fiennes, yesterday reached the summit of the Eiger after successfully scaling its treacherous north face.
Trying To Breath On Mt. Everest teachersdomain.org The decreased atmospheric pressure and low levels of oxygen can have very dangerous effects on a climber's body.
Checking Email At 17,000 Feet CNET China Mobile has opened a wireless service center and Internet cafe at an altitude of 17,000 feet at the Everest base camp, making it the world's highest such site.
What makes risk takers risk it all?
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"Because it is there" seems a rather simplistic and unimaginative answer to me. I'd sooner give credit to, "because it's in the way and I'm too damn lazy to go around it." Until there is a Michelin Five Star restaurant on top of one of those things, I see no attraction whatsoever in climbing one. Even with such a lure, I would still be looking for the cog or funicular railway to get me there. Climbers, like marathon runners, never look like they are having fun. They tend to resemble the cast of Das Boot at the end of their adventure, and who wants to look like that?
Like our reason for doing most things (and NOT doing them), a great deal of the answer lies in our personal sense of identity. Is anything in the world more valuable than your identity? Your understanding of who you are (and who you are not)?
When you look at yourself in the mirror, whom do you want to see staring back at you? If the answer is, "I want to see a man who has climbed Mount Everest!" then you cough up the money, take the risk, and go. No medals or knighthoods bestowed by others could possibly match Hillary and Norgay's own sense of pride. For as long as they lived, any time they looked in the mirror, there was a man who had climbed Everest staring back at them.
I think that George Mallory’s answer of “Because it is there.” to the question of why climb the mountain, may be a bit on the humble side, and only a partial answer at that.
I tend to believe that the more complete answer to that question, regardless of the feat it is in reference to, would certainly contain the “because it is there”
portion, but also be followed by “because I desire this and I truly believe that my best effort will enable me to do it”.
If this attitude and behavior is nothing more than the symptoms of some disorder that’s described by a three letter acronym or a brain chemical imbalance, I only have one thing to say. Sign me up for it, right now!
Is it foolish and wasteful to risk so much for anything that seems to have no practical benefit for anyone? Of course it is, and perhaps a bit arrogant too, at least on the surface! But then I close my eyes and think of these great feats of human strength, determination and endurance, and because of them, I can at least imagine how it feels to have reached for the stars and touched one.
These seemingly senseless feats have quickened the imaginations and dreams of many generations. They continue to push back the barriers of possibility. What could be better?
I'm a marathoner, triathlete and high altitude hiker/climber. I also do solo, often risky, mountain biking. There's always a risk involved.
Why do I do it? Same reason I joined the Marines. The challenge, the thrill, the opportunity to go beyong the edge, to step outside the "comfort zone." I'll admit I'm probably an adreline junkie, a risk taker. And it's not because I having a boring job. I had an exciting first career before I had a mid-life career change. My second career has been in construction and real estate. I frequently worked on industrial and commercal buildings, sometimes way above ground level. In real estate, I've worked hard to be successful. I'm not afraid to take a chance. I'll knock on a door, make a phone call, put a deal together knowing there's a high chance of failure and rejection. I would like very much to invest/develope commercial projects and own commercial property.Why? Because there's a risk involved.
I don't care about the money as much as I like the rush of achieving something worthwhile. The money is a way to keep score.
As to Mallory. Mallory said "because it's there" out of frustration on an American fund raising tour because reporters kept asking him about Everest. His real reason was, as he said later, the sheer joy of climbing. He believed the purpose of life, the meaning, the goal of life was to experience this joy.
I'm not sure that anyone can understand this who does not understand the lure of adventure, of risk itself. I understand there's a small percentage of "crazy people" like me. I know there have been scientific studies of rik-takers. I know there is a dark side to it. Some people take foolish risks sexually, some with narcotics. The bright side is the discovery and exploration of new worlds, entreprenuerial enterprise, pioneers in global trade, creative expression.
But I'm also risk adverse to some things. I don't fancy jumping out of an airplane with a parachute or deep sea diving. I'm not sure I'd fight in another war (unless it was in defense of the country when the country was actually invaded).
Yes, we marathoners are having fun. The first one is hell, the second one is because you know the hell you'll go through and the challenge it presents. But it is a calculated risk. I prepare, I train, I know my body, I know nutrition. The person who decides today to do a triathlon tomorrow without any training is just plain stupid. That's not risk-taking.
The joy to me is not only the challenge to my body and mind but the challenge I face in business, too. It's about confronting the unknown and the unknowable and surviving and thriving.
It's about the joy.
Now boys, is climbing Everest always about the adrenaline rush, or could it also be about seeing a beautiful place from a vantage point that few have enjoyed?
Feel free to tell me if this is a stupid and obvious question, but that's what I've always thought...
Dutchman said...
There was a funny story about Mallory at a party a week before his climb that I hope was true. He was somewhat sloshed, staring at an attractive young lady's derriere and someone asked him why? He said, "Because it was there." Turns out it was his
catchphrase...that was finally put to Zen like use.
As far as a beautiful view you can get that flying over the place. And how exactly long can an adrenalin rush last?
I do believe there are experiences in life, that words cannot explain.
rings90 said...
What's in it for the average lunatic? I'm not sure what's in for the average Lunatic....
I kind of agree with Heiress in the fact that it maybe the scenery. Whether seeing it as standing stationary from the top of a mountain or free falling from a plane until the parachute opens it's still something that very few people take the risk to see.
The average Lunatic maybe just a new crop of pioneers that are exploring things that most people never dreamed of. Or maybe they are just dreamers who's dreams sometimes are realized & sometimes not.
I'm not really a risk taker the biggest risk I have taken in the last year was flying in a Cessna 4 seater airplane over Lake Michigan to Washington Island & back at nightime. I hate to fly so this was a HUGE lesson in overcoming my fear of planes in general + it was night when we left the Island which has a grass runway. We actually had to wait for the deer to get off the runway before we could leave. It was great fun & I loved it. But really it was quite a once in alife time chance + in my eyes a risk in my own little life. So why did I do it? Becuase in all trueth I had the chance to. I'm not so sure that's really different than Mallory's answer of because its there.
Heiress,
If what you think is not the actual reason, i.e.," seeing a beautiful place from a vantage point that few have enjoyed", you have certainly come up with the perfect metaphor to describe it. If I could, that would be why I did, but I suspect there are a variety of reasons.
Be well
As Aslan and Roonwit cried, "Further in and higher up!"
I think it must have to do with innate resolve that some people have or hear the calling of to develop. Sometimes I think that call has to do with knowing somewhere inside of us that we have the capacity to do whatever we want (that we are put on this earth with all the tools we need, but may not recognize). That doesn't mean it happens easily or the same for everyone.
With the climbers, the physical training for peak performance must be excruciating . That's what most people think of when you say, "climb a mountain". But then you must get there and realize that even though your body/the machine that was given to you has been well conditioned and oiled, it can be the mental part that is far larger.
I would imagine that it is the complete harmony of the two that the climber/adventurer is after - The relationship between the mental/spiritual and physical parts of a being?
I may wax eloquent at this point (bear with me), but couldn't it be that that harmony (however it is achieved) is the stuff of life - the so called meaning?
To: girlinthemoon,
That's it.
Some people reach this harmony through yoga or zen sitting meditation. The fact that such harmony and perfection is "just out of reach" and rarely achieved, and when it is, slips out of your grasp quickly, is no reason not to do it.
The body is a well designed machine. It can go for a long time before it gives up. Usually the mind gives out long before the body when you're engaged in a physical challenge. When the body is injured, of course, you stop, the challenge is over. But so much of the pain and suffering of a physical challenge can be overcome by mental training.
Where there's a will, there's a way. (But proper training is neccessary)
As I read each new thought, each different perspective, it seems to me there could not possibly be any all-encompassing, silver bullet of an answer to this very intriguing question at hand. It may boil down to the reality that every question does not have, nor necessarily require an answer. I'm not sure that those who embark on these seemingly impossible, certainly improbable quests, bother to dwell on the why. It might just serve to slow them down.
Maybe it is just "because it's there"? Maybe it's a sense of destiny, or perhaps overcompensating for some feelings if insecurity? Maybe it just seemed like a good idea at the time.
To me, I have to say the "why of it" just doesn't matter. I'm just grateful that we as a species have these dreams, these visions of overcoming all odds, and knowing that there will always be someone capable of accomplishing the impossible.
As "Freewheeling Frankie" said in the late '60s, "onward through the fog"!
zackchange said...
Because it's there, sure, but also because it's hard. People like challenges. Overcoming great odds and risks is part of the human spirit and competitive nature. Plus, it's fun to brag about something you did, that other people can't do.
Spinner said...
I think there is a difference in taking on great challenges and challenges that involve great physical risks. When I read about these people who risk their lives to accomplish.. what?..I always ask, "Why?" I am constantly pushing the envelope with projects that DON'T involve life-threatening risk and feel pretty good for accomplishing them. And I know I will be around after to do that appreciating. For instance, I am 68 and have gotten myself up to swimming a straight 2500 yards and then immediately go back in and teach three water exercise classes in a row. That took some training to be able to sustain that level of exertion and quietly, in my soul, I am very proud of myself for being able to do that two days a week. But there is no risk to life and limb. That, I do not understand. But... That's me. Having a genetics background, I do wonder about the biochemistry part of this. And when I watch A.J. Foyt IV participate in the Indy 500, I tend to believe there is an inherited mutant gene in that family somewhere. Probably on the Y chromosome.
"Onc Doc said...
"Because it is there" seems a rather simplistic and unimaginative answer to me. I'd sooner give credit to, "because it's in the way and I'm too damn lazy to go around it." Until there is a Michelin Five Star restaurant on top of one of those things, I see no attraction whatsoever in climbing one. ... Climbers, like marathon runners, never look like they are having fun. They tend to resemble the cast of Das Boot"
I kind of wonder why people bother to go to med school? Seems like a big exercise in frustration and long hours beating your head against books, studying for painfully long exams. I also wonder why anybody would want to go into Oncology. All those cancer patients, they don't look like they're having any fun. Neither do the doctors for that matter.
The only possible reasons I can see for anyone to become a doctor or lead an expedition to Everest is for the challenge. Perhaps these types people want to see what they are capable of. They want to explore their own limits and expand their boundaries. Perhaps they enjoy leading a team, or even... maybe they enjoy being responsible for other people's lives? I wonder if there is kind of a thrill in that?
girlonthemoon, you have hit the nail on the head when you say "That doesn't mean it happens easily or the same for everyone". This is the very crux of the matter. It doesn't happen easily and it must not. As zackchange also points out, people do it BECAUSE it is hard.
I am reminded of the brilliant scene in "A League of Their Own" when Manager Dugan gets upset with Dottie for quitting the baseball team. She complains, "It just got too hard." He retorts, "It's supposed to be hard! If it weren't hard, everyone would do it. The hard is what makes it great."
By the same token, the second half of your sentence is equally important. It's not the same for everyone. Spinner points out, quite reasonably, that the challenges she likes to face do not involve this kind of risk. Yet, for some, no other challenge will do. And, at the risk of sounding horribly cliche, isn't that kind of variety precisely what makes the world go round?
So, yes. It absolutely isn't easy. And it absolutely isn't the same for everyone. AND THANK GOD!
Dutchman said...
I think for some of these people, taking physical risks may be easier than
taking emotional risks.
Spearfish: Everyone enjoys being responsible for other people's lives. It's the concept of power that, no matter how much one tries to deny it, everyone likes to feel.
But the thing is, there is some enjoyment one gets out of it. There might not be some five-star restaurant, but there sure is, like Spinner said, a great view. To stand on the top of the world - it's not the sort of thing you see from an airplane. To deny the magnificence of that is like saying that you went to the top of the Empire State Building to see the gift shop.
And to further the idea of no apparent profit from climbing this great big thing, one might ask what profit there is in doing anything, really. What do we get out of drinking lemonade rather than water? Some extra excitement from the tartness of the lemon? But it's breaking down the enamel on our teeth. What a risk. We might as well dress all in grey jumpsuits, eat nothing but tofu, and sleep all day. There's no profit in a lot of stuff we do, but we do it anyway.
To girlonthemoon:
By the way, I did not get the chance to join the other regulars in welcoming you the other day. Loved your posts and I'm dying to know WHICH caftan you were referring to. For myself, picking a favorite Peterman garment is kind of like picking a favorite child; I love them all, each for its own unique charm. The most practical seems to be my Hemingway Cap, as the long visor keeps the rain off my face while I work outdoors.
Do you get your charming moniker from that gloriously strange Fritz Lang movie? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0019901/
p.s. sorry, that wasn't Spinner that said the thing about the view - that was Heiress.
Spinner,
You are my hero!
Spinner said...
What did I do?
swim 2500 yards and then teach!
To: Spinner,
You are a hero to me, too. Swimming 2500 yards isn't easy. I'm 59 and "swim" or half-drown in the swim phase of triathlons. Even 500 yards (my first Tri) was brutal. You swim a tri a little different than a regular swim. You don't want to use your legs to their full extent because that will leave you with less ability on the bike, which will then leave you in bad shape for the run.
Plus in a tri you are swimming with people who enjoy swimming over the top of you or kicking you in the head.
2500 yards! Excellent! When I'm 68 I hope I can do as much!
DPR, thank you for the very kind welcome! It is always so nice when a board is open to a new voice. Boards have their own unique culture - in this case I get the sense that the board is cultured and very open to the art of conversation.
Sadly, I don't remember the name of my caftan and I don't believe it is still in the catalog (Mr. Peterman, perhaps you can help here? It is in oranges, reds, blues and dark green. The stripes have paisleys in them and run vertically and it also has true sleeves).
I received it as an early Christmas gift last year and I wore it Christmas morning while I opened gifts next to my siblings who were seated around the tree - a perfect christening!
I am eyeing this one now:
It is a gloriously strange movie, but no - my name isn't taken from Frau im Mond.
My moniker was born the night my husband proposed to me. We were up in the mountains on a deck sky gazing and he mused that he had never been able to see the man in the moon.
I said, "that's because it's a girl". The moon happened to be very full that night. He looked up and said, "Oh my gosh, I see her!"
And he really did. Right away.
She kind of looks like an idealized Victorian girl to me - large eyes and small lips - profile more to the side. I have always seen a girl for some reason.
Can you post pictures here?
Just a little test:
[img]http://jpeterman.com/images/jpeterman/2299.jpg[/img]
That is the caftan I am eying :)
No embedding images though . . .
Spinner said...
Thank you. I appreciate your appreciation. I don't like to sweat, even though I do that as well. So I mostly swim. There wasn't much in the way of swim teams when I was a kid, so I did syncronized swimming in college. Our son swam competitively from the time he was 5 until his soph. year at Ball State. His coach during his HS days started a masters team with the parents of his kids. And the rest is history. I did set the state record for the 50yd butterfly in the 50-54 age bracket that held for 11 years, but I, in no way, want to compete any more. I am much more conpetitive with myself and the clock than other people. That is my "Mt. Everest", me and the calendar. I strongly believe that we as a culture coddle the elderly. They are capable of a whole lot more than we give them credit for. Thus in my classes, I push them to work to their limits. In fact, about 2 months ago, I said that we were now going to move up to "version 2.0". They went along with it because I too am getting to be their age (a lot in their 70's, 80's, and even one 94yo!). There are testimonials all the time about their doctor's visits and how flabbergasted the dr's were with their improvement and strength. They constantly report how much better their quality of life is. And the size of my classes keeps growing. The instructor that keeps things very calm, low key and.. essentially easy, doesn't have much success. So I preach to one and all to keep it moving! You don't need to reach out to find some bit of danger to make life satisfying, you can find great satisfaction with hard physical work and the improvement that hard work will mean to your everyday life.
Oh, oh.. the band is back and warming up so I better close.
ExPat: I understand that those that are the stronger swimmers make the better triathletes because the swim leg doesn't tire them so. Is that true or only what us swimmers say?
To: Spinner,
The stronger swimmers do have an advantage. They get to the bikes faster. The real hope is to catch them in the bike leg. Overall the triathlon is about conserving energy and time management. I'm a strong cyclist (mountain bike and road bike) and can endure a 26 mile run quite well. If I could improve my swim technique I think I'd have a better time. One day I hope to come in the top 10 in my age group.
So many people who are older than me do very well. I've noticed they have a background in swimming.
To compete well you have to give up something in each event. For example, if you want to be a fast runner, you can cross-train on a bike, but you really want to run most of the time. Thus you may not do well in the triathlon. You have to train in each event to do well in each event. The triathlon is a multi-sport event, it's not a cross-training event.
Years ago I almost drowned in a body-surfing accident so I've had to overcome a fear of water, especially dark water, to compete. You'd think that the panic I feel would make me swim faster (Ha!Ha!).